Deposition - Florence de FornierDéposition - Florence de Fornier

Document IDDocument ID: MS609-0082
How to citeComment citer : Rehr, JP. The Registry of the “Great Inquisition” at Toulouse, 1245-46: Edition of BM Toulouse MS609 (doc. MS609-0082). http://medieval-inquisition.huma-num.fr/documents/MS609-0082, acc. 2020-10-01

EditionÉdition

ReferencesRéférences :
  • Jean Duvernoy, ed.,  Le manuscrit 609 de la bibliothèque municipale de Toulouse. Lauragais 1245-1246, 1253,  http://jean.duvernoy.free.fr/text/listetexte.htm,  accessed 2017-08-01: 16
  • John Arnold, Peter Biller, eds.,  Heresy and Inquisition in France, 1200-1300,  Manchester, Manchester University Press, 2016: 388
  • Austin Evans, ed.,  Interrogatoires subis par des hérétiques albigeois par-devant frère Bernard de Caux, inquisiteur, de 1245 à 1253,  BX4890 B47 1255g , Butler Library, Columbia University, New York
Edition statusEtat de l'édition:
  • LatinLatin-draftbrouillon (last revisiondenière revision 2018-12-10)
  • EnglishAnglais-draftbrouillon (last revisiondenière revision 2018-12-10)

 Item. Anno et die quo supra.1 Florensa, uxor quondam Petri de Forners, soror predicte Raimunde , testis iurata dixit quod stetit per medium annum apud Laurac cum Willelma Audema, amita ipsius testis, heretica. Et comedebat et bibibat cum ipsa et pluries  adoraverunt eam sicut dicta heretica docebat ipsam testis adorare. Et sunt XX anni vel circa.

Item dixit quod stetit apud Cabareth  cum viro suo per duos annos. Et vidit ibi plures hereticos et hereticas. Et pluries adoravit eos et audivit predicationem eorum.  Et vidit quod omnes homines et mulieres in villa veniebant ad predicationem hereticorum publice et adoravit eos. Et sunt XVIII anni vel circa.

Item. Dixit quod dum ipsa testis et Raimunda soror sua starent apud Narbonam venerunt ad domum ipsius testis et sororis sui quidam qui vocabatur W. Bertrandi cum aliis IIIIor hominibus, et comederunt in domo ipsius testis. Et dicti homines  erant nuncii hereticorum, et duxerant duos hereticos ad domum Raimundi Iohannis de Narbona. Sed ipsa testis neque soror sua sciebant hoc. Sed postea audierunt dici quando fuit captus dictus Raimundus Iohannis, et tunc balivus domini archepiscopi Narbonensis cepit ipsam testem et Raimundam, a sororem suam, et duxit eas ad curiam domini archiepiscopi. Et tunc frater Ferrarius, qui tunc erat inquisitor, auctoritate domini archiepiscopi reconciliavit ipsam testem et Raimundam, sororem ipsius testis. Et dimiserunt ipsas ire, et tunc idem frater Ferrarius ivit cum Ramunda sorore sua usque ad Mansum et reddidit eam viro suo. Et sunt XVI anni vel circa. Et postea non vidit hereticos.2

Predictos hereticos credidit esse bonos homines et habere bonam fidem et posse salvari per ipsos licet sciret quod ecclesia persequereter eos. Et audivit eos dicentes errores de visibilibus quod deus non fecerat eam, et quod hostia sacrata non erat  corpus Christi, et quod corpora mortuoram non resurgent, et quod in baptismo et matrimonio non erat salus, et ipsa credebat  sicut ipsi dicebant. Et sunt XXII anni quod primo credidit hereticos esse bonos, sed non credidit postquam frater Ferrarius reconciliavit ipsam nec postea vidit hereticos nisi captos. Omnia predicta fuit confessa fratri Ferrario apud Saysac. Et abiuravit et cetera. Testes: predicti.

  • a exp. uxorem

[2] Item. Anno et die quo supra.1 Florensa, uxor quondam Petri de Forners, soror predicte Raimunde , testis iurata dixit quod stetit per[3] medium [annum] apud Laurac cum Willelma Audema, amita ipsius testis, heretica. Et comedebat et bibibat cum ipsa et pluries[4] adoraverunt eam sicut dicta heretica docebat ipsam testis adorare. Et sunt XX anni vel circa. Item dixit quod stetit apud Cabareth [5] cum viro suo per duos annos. Et vidit ibi plures hereticos et hereticas. Et pluries adoravit eos et audivit predicationem eorum.[6] Et vidit quod omnes homines et mulieres in villa veniebant ad predicationem hereticorum publice et adoravit eos. Et[7] sunt XVIII anni vel circa. Item. Dixit quod dum ipsa testis et Raimunda soror sua starent apud Narbonam venerunt ad domum[7] ipsius testis et sororis sui quidam qui vocabatur W. Bertrandi cum aliis IIIIor hominibus, et comederunt in domo ipsius testis. Et dicti homines[8] erant nuncii hereticorum, et duxerant duos hereticos ad domum Raimundi Iohannis de Narbona. Sed ipsa testis neque soror sua sciebant[9] hoc. Sed postea audierunt dici quando fuit captus dictus Raimundus Iohannis, et tunc balivus domini archepiscopi Narbonensis cepit ipsam[10] testem et Raimundam, a sororem suam, et duxit eas ad curiam domini archiepiscopi. Et tunc frater Ferrarius, qui tunc erat inquisitor,[11] auctoritate domini archiepiscopi reconciliavit ipsam testem et Raimundam, sororem ipsius testis. Et dimiserunt ipsas ire, et tunc idem frater[12] Ferrarius ivit cum Ramunda sorore sua usque ad Mansum et reddidit eam viro suo. Et sunt XVI anni vel circa. Et postea non[13] vidit hereticos.2 Predictos hereticos credidit esse bonos homines et habere bonam fidem et posse salvari per ipsos licet sciret quod ecclesia perseque[14] reter eos. Et audivit eos dicentes errores de visibilibus quod deus non fecerat eam, et quod hostia sacrata non erat[15] corpus Christi, et quod corpora mortuoram non resurgent, et quod in baptismo et matrimonio non erat salus, et ipsa credebat[16] sicut ipsi dicebant. Et sunt XXII anni quod primo credidit hereticos esse bonos, sed non credidit postquam frater Ferrarius reconciliavit[17] ipsam nec postea vidit hereticos nisi captos. Omnia predicta fuit confessa fratri Ferrario apud Saysac. Et abiuravit et cetera. Testes: predicti.

  • a exp. uxorem

Item. Year and day as above. The sworn witness Florence, wife of Peire de Forners, sister of the above Ramunda, said that she stayed for half a year at Laurac with her aunt Guilhelma Audena, heretic, and ate and drink with her, and many adored her and the aforesaid heretic Guilhelma taught her to adore. This was about 20 years ago.

Item. The witness said that she stayed in Caberet with her husband for two years, and she saw there the aforementioned heretics and others adore them and she heard them preach, and she saw that many men and women from the village come to the public preaching of the heretics, and they adored them. This was about 28 years ago.

Item. The witness said that while she and her sister Raimunda stayed at Narbonne someone called W. Bertrand came to their house with four men, and they ate in their home, and the aforesaid men were heretic messengers, and they lead two heretics to the house of Raimund Johan. But neither the witness nor her sister knew of this, but afterwards they heard that said Raimund Johan was captured, and then the bailiff of lord Archbishop of Narbonne seized the witness and her sister and brought them to the court of the Archbishop, and then brother Ferrier, who was then inquisitor under the authority of the lord Archbishop, reconciled the witness and her sister Raimunda. And they let them go, and then brother Ferrier went with her sister Raimunda to Mas-Saintes-Puelles and handed her over to her husband. This was about 16 years ago, and thereafter she has not seen any heretics.

The witness believed the aforementioned heretics to be good men, and to have to good faith, and that one could be saved by them, even though she knew they were persecuted by the Church. And she heard them speak of errors, that God did not make visible things, that the holy host is not the body of Christ, that the dead do not rise, and that there is no salvation in baptism or marriage. She believed as they said, and it was 22 years ago that she first believed heretics to be good. But she no longer believed such after brother Ferrier reconciled her, nor did she see heretics thereafter, except prisoners. All of the foregoing was confessed to brother Ferrier at Saissac. She abjured heresy, etc. Witnesses as above.

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  • SourceSource: BM Toulouse MS 609
  • Shelf Mark/FolioCote/Folio: 5v
  • Document DateDate de document: 1245-07-01
  • GroupGroupe: Mas-Saintes-Puelles (1)

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  • Ferrier, frater ordinis predicatorum, inquisitor
  • Florence de Fornier
  • Guilhelma Audena
  • Peire Amelh, archbishop of Narbonne
  • Peire de Fornier
  • Raimund Johan de Narbonne
  • Raimunda Gondaubou
  • Guilhem Bertrand

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  • Cabaret
  • domus of Guilhelma Audenadomus de Guilhelma Audena
  • domus of Raimunda Gondaubou and Florence de Fornersdomus de Raimunda Gondaubou et Florence de Forners
  • Laurac
  • Mas-Saintes-Puelles
  • Narbonne
  • Saissac

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  • MS609-0082-1
  • MS609-0082-2
  • MS609-0082-3
  • MS609-0082-4

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